Lost - “Because You Left” and “The Lie”

By DonnaK
54321 (2 votes)

DonnaK:  Just in case you missed the warning above…. SPOLIERS!!!! SPOILERS!!!! Everything in this post will be a spoiler! If you don’t want the show spoiled STOP READING NOW!!!! This will be a general policy for all my Lost posts, so you have been warned.

....

Still here? Cool. Now we can talk.

Before I get going I just want to get an opening statement out of the way. You all know how hard a time I give Tim Kring and Heroes for their continuity and writing problems. I think I’ve established the fact that I’d like to see at least some kind of effort on the part of show creators and writers to keep continuity, to not ret-con things to death, to give the plot moving forward and to not be in a state of constant contradiction to yourself. Season three of Lost had me swearing about as badly as this last season of Heroes has. I thought Abrams et al were being lazy, smug, disrespectful writers who didn’t care that they had totally and completely lost the plot to their own show (pun fully intended)

Season four changed my mind. I truly believe that the writers of Lost, knowing that they now had only 23 episodes or so to wrap this whole mess up, sat down with an enormous list of all the problems and loopholes and contradictions they had created over the years and began a concerted effort to try and fix as much as they could. I think that they made great strides towards tying things together in season four and I was very happy with how it went. I went from being nearly done with the show to being extremely excited to see if they could continue what I felt was a good trend.

Now, I recognize that the Lost people shouldn’t have put themselves in a position where they have to go back and work so damn hard to tie everything together. If they had been paying attention from jump they wouldn’t be in this mess, and for some people this will always be a block to their enjoyment of the show. For me, the fact that I see that Abrams et al are actively trying to fix their won mess is enough for me to give them quite a bit of leeway. So if you’re here hoping to hear a Heroes-type rant, you won’t be getting one. And if/when Kring and Fuller start trying to clean up their mess on Heroes I’ll start cutting them more slack too. In my mind, the guys from Lost have earned some slack and I’ll give it to them as long as I see they keep trying.

Okay… off my soapbox. On to the show. I’m going to do this sort-of Heroes style - bullet points to talk about various elements of the show and to open discussions or give my theories as to what I think is happening. I’ll also make every effort to get these posts out in as timely a manner as possible in the future - I truly apologize for the lateness of this first post.

Let’s begin:
—I do have to begin with a problem. In my memory serves me correctly, at the end of season four the people on the raft saw the island disappear. Yet at the very beginning of the first episode, the island is there and Daniel claims they must have been inside the island’s time radius. Am I crazy or was that ret-conned? Anyone?
—I am SO grateful to finally have a timeline that is fixed. We now know for certain that “present day” is three years from the moving of the island. No more guessing as to flash-forwards or backwards or sideways. It was refreshing to get that cleared up - it made for a much less confusing viewing.
—I do wonder about the final fate of the freighter. Do you all think it truly sunk? Is there any chance Jin is alive? My theory is that the freighter did sink and Jin did die a martyr, but there is always the chance that the boat was close enough to the island’s energy that “something” could have affected that. I hope they keep it simple though and just let all those characters go, I truly do. I think the more they keep pairing down the cast the easier it will be to both follow everyone and care about who we’re following.
—I’ve seen online that A LOT of people had trouble following the “time jumps” of the people on the island. I didn’t have a single problem with it nor did I have any issues about it. In fact, I thought it was and is a pretty brilliant way to remind people of certain key events and to keep the action flowing. I greatly enjoyed the time travels and hope they continue to be handled well.
—Since we’re on the subject of time and how the island and it’s inhabitants are currently bending the fabric of space and time, let’s talk for a moment about Desmond. He’s always had issues with time, right back to when we first met him. Could this event on the island (or a similar one in the future or past) be the thing that “bent” him (so to speak)? If you think about it, Desmond has been both on and off the island as it’s been moving through time. We also know that he and Daniel have a connection and he’s on his way to Oxford to try and right things. Is Desmond caught between timelines? Has he ALWAYS been caught between timelines? Daniel claims emphatically that the past and future are fixed, but I believe the actions of both Desmond (in his repeated sucesses in saving Charlie) and Ben (in setting up his whole life off the island) prove him wrong. However, I can buy that at some point Desmond got “caught” in time and because of that has always had parts of his consciousness in multiple timelines. What do you guys think? Am I crazy or onto something?
—I’m quite intrigued as to why Locke has to die in order to help stop the time issues on the island. I realize that Locke sacrificing himself for the island plays into the Locke-as-Christ metphor (and Jack as Doubting Thomas BTW), but I can’t quite grasp how his death will help yet. I don’t think we have enough information yet, but this is a plotline I’m very interested in following.
—Off the island and to the present for a bit. Let’s start with the obvious question - why do the six (plus Locke and Ben) need to return to the island to stop it’s movement through time? What is it about these people that the island seems to need? Locke told Jack before Jack left not to go, that the island needed them, that everyone NEEDED to stay. Why? My theory - the plane crash was NOT an accident as Desmond has been thinking for so long. I think the island, for whatever reason, needed some of the people on that plane for some purpose. I think the crash was forced by the energies of the island and that these people need to serve a function for the island. What that function is or could be we have no way of knowing yet, but again this is something I will be paying VERY VERY close attention to.
—Interesting plot dilemma - will Sun’s baby have to go back to the island too? Sun was barely into her second trimester if memory serves. Would her fetus count as “a person”? I think the writers mayhaps have tripped into something here… like a pro-life debate. If Sun’s baby doesn’t have to go back then she wasn’t yet a person, but if she does then she was, even at such a young stage of development. This could be a sticky situation. Add in the fact that I can’t see ANY way Sun is going to bring her baby back to the island - let alone want to go herself - and I think we have ourselves a problem. Here’s another one - what about Walt? Does he have to go back? Who is important to the island? Why are these people important to the island? Is it a question of quantum mechanics - certain pieces of energy were needed and these certain people had that kind of energy? It’s clear none of the “Others” have to return like Jack and company do - why not? This whole thing is very fascinating to me - I really really hope the writers stay on top of this and try to have it make as much sense as they can.
—What was the final straw between Said and Ben? Why would Said warn Hurley to never ever trust anything Ben said? I know we saw Said and Ben “break up” in season four, but I don’t recall anything so serious as to turn Said that much against Ben. Did I miss something or have we just not been given that information yet?
—Why didn’t Hurley listen to Ben when Ben gave his impassioned speech to return to the island at Hurley’s house? Hurley KNOWS that Ben is right. He knew everything Ben was saying was in fact true. And we also know that Hurley told Said on the boat back home that one day Said would ask Hurley to do something important and Hurley wouldn’t listen to him because Said agreed to the lie. So why did Hurley side with Said and not Ben at that moment? Reason says he should have gone with Ben, emotion says we would trust Said. I just wish Hurley knew was we as the viewers know….
—Sun’s motivations confuse me. It was Whitmore’s crew that sent the freighter that directly led to Jin’s death, not Ben. So why would she want to align herself with Whitmore against Ben? This one makes no sense to me - anyone got an opinion here?
—Questions yet to be even touched on: What about Claire and Jacob and the shack… what the hell’s going on there? How many spirits are still caught in this island’s energy? What the hell with Daniel being in the opening sequence of the episode in the building of the Orchid station WAY back in the past? How the hell did he get there… or is he originally from there and did he travel to this timeline? And the big one, the one that I swear better be answered somehow or I will go postal on someone… WHAT THE HELL DO THE NUMBERS MEAN???

Okay, that’s all I’ve got for the moment. I open the floor - what do you guys think? Opinions? Comments? Debates? Let’s hear them!


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01/25/2009 6:30 PM
Categories: TV
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Comments

1  West Virginia Rebel West Virginia Rebel wrote:

Hurley is paranoid…after all he’s been through I’m not surprised he wouldn’t trust Ben. Ben may be telling the truth, but he’s a manipulative SOB…is he really looking for redemption, or just away to take control of the island?

Did Locke really kill himself? I don’t think so…

The Numbers. Various ages in the characters’ past or future lives? Space-time coordinates? Latitude and longitude of where the island is as it moves through time (perhaps a future location or two?)

United States   01/26 at 08:32 AM  

2   juddling wrote:

I remember hearing somewhere that the creators said the numbers don’t really mean anything.  At this point, almost any explanation would either be implausable or be a major let down.

I think Sun is actually working towards setting up Widmore because she blames him for Jin.  Is she doing it with Ben??  I’m still not sure..but my gut feeling is she’s on her own.  One thing about her this past episode…when she was talking to Kate about Jin and the freighter.  Even though she said she didn’t blame Kate..the tone in her voice said otherwise. 

Since it appears that Daniel and Desmond have this special connection, maybe Daniel is able to jump through time as well.  His character is getting interesting finally.  He seems to be the only one who knoews what’s going on..and i liked to see Sawyer bitch slap it out of him.

United States   01/26 at 10:02 AM  

3  DonnaK DonnaK wrote:

and i liked to see Sawyer bitch slap it out of him.

.... I just kinda liked seeing Sawyer shirtless for the whole first episode. grin

United States   01/26 at 05:13 PM  

4  chuQue chuQue wrote:

at the end of season four the people on the raft saw the island disappear.

If MY memory serves correct it went like this.

people on island hear noise, see flash
cut to people on raft see flash
cut to people on chopper see island disappear. 

I’m quite intrigued as to why Locke has to die in order to help stop the time issues on the island.

I too am wondering about this, I am thinking that Locke is only mostly dead.

will Sun’s baby have to go back to the island too?

Only if she can’t find a babysitter.

So why would she want to align herself with Whitmore against Ben?

Friends close, enemies closer?

the one that I swear better be answered somehow or I will go postal on someone… WHAT THE HELL DO THE NUMBERS MEAN???

I kind of hope they don’t answer this one.

What I like about this show over heroes is that there is a feeling of more information to come, so it isn’t a plot hole, or continuity error ... yet. 

I have faith that most of the questions will be answered and a few never will be.

United States   01/26 at 09:48 PM  

5   juddling wrote:

Scifi.com has an interview with the head Lost guys from back in 2005 where they insist NO TIMETRAVEL in involved. I guess that didn’t work out as planned

United States   01/26 at 11:05 PM  

6  chuQue chuQue wrote:

they insist NO TIMETRAVEL in involved.

I am going to laugh when the last episode comes around and Bob Newheart wakes up and says “... no more chili before bed!”

United States   01/26 at 11:16 PM  

7  DonnaK DonnaK wrote:

Scifi.com has an interview with the head Lost guys from back in 2005 where they insist NO TIMETRAVEL in involved. I guess that didn’t work out as planned

Dude… absolutely NOTHING anyone said or did from way back then has anything to do with what’s happening now. The Lost writers completely lost the plot towards the end of season two, let alone the goat0fuck that was season three. We’ll never get answers to some of the great things they dangled in front of us back then (remember the statue with four toes?). We can’t hold the writers to anything they said or promises they made back then because they, quite simply, screwed themselves so badly in seasons two and three. Season four is really the beginning of what will get resolved, how this will end, what’s important, and so on. Now… for most of this we’re still going to have to remember and be able to recall everything that has happened throughout the series, which will just remind us of the inconsistencies… such a goat fuck.

But… they’re trying. I have to give them that. The ideas that are swirling around now are good and solid and make sense, and it’s obvious the writers are doing everything they can to make up for the shit they’ve pulled. hence me giving them a great deal of slack. I appreciate the fact that they’re trying. I know they shouldn’t have to, nor should I have to work this hard to follow a show, but I’m already in the pool… might as well keep swimming, right? *shrugs* That’s where I sit anyways.

United States   01/27 at 01:41 AM  

8  chuQue chuQue wrote:

I still don’t see season 3 as a “Goat0fuck”  it was a story starting at the middle and working towards the beginning and ending.  I enjoy the fact they have drastically changed the storytelling technique each season.  I will give you that it was a radical change from the previous season, but I don’t recall any blaring continuity errors, just a lot of unanswered questions in a rather hard to follow format. However it was at the start of season 3 they knew the show would end after the 5 season so that allowed them to swing for the fences and open arcs they knew weren’t getting closed any time soon.  I think a lot of things will get resolved before it is over.

again odd, that I have such a lenient stance of lost but seething annoyance for heroes, when a some of these points could be used there as well.

I guess in the end the toy sword really reallly annoyed me.

United States   01/27 at 02:45 AM  

9  Joe R. Joe R. wrote:

1) I also don’t think the numbers will ever be explained in any thorough basis.

2) What got me with the scene between Hurley and Ben is why Hurley didn’t just call Jack or Sayid on his cell phone.  “Hey dude, did you send Ben?”  Obviously the writers want Hurley to be hard for Ben to reach but that was an illogical way to get there.

3) Sayid throwing the guy onto the knives in the dishwasher?  AWESOME.

4) I’m wondering if Hurley isn’t really crazy, but just has the same ability to talk to dead people that Miles has (and doesn’t realize it).

5) Sun is crazy.  She’s lost her goddamned mind.

China   01/27 at 10:10 AM  

10   supercore wrote:

I remember hearing somewhere that the creators said the numbers don’t really mean anything.

And then I remembered that you can’t trust a fucking thing that comes out of those guys mouths.

Here’s the lostpedia article about them if you’re interested.

The only thing that really bugged me in the episode was the knives in the washer thing. Was it cool? Fuck yeah. Believable? Not so much.

I loved seeing the peanut-butter-mouth guy getting set on fire though. Classic.

United States   01/27 at 01:54 PM  

11  chuQue chuQue wrote:

I was thinking….

I do hope that the big full series box set makes use of some of the blu-ray technology to make seamless chapter jumps for a chronological showing, just to see if I am right about what/when/how some thing have happened.

man I would have to take 3 weeks off of work to watch the whole series, all the commentary and then the whole thing again to spot background details.

United States   01/28 at 08:04 PM  


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